Sunday, October 25, 2009

Almost 1 yr on to Hope Movement Split

It almost now 1yr to the time our Hope Movement was split because of Dr.Joseph and PN action in the Hope Movement. And from that time until there was a number of big changes.
HGI was renamed to HIM now led by Ps Simon, Hope Bangkok Church was split with PN leading one side and Rubina leading the other. Some other churches as well split from Hope and have remained such.

In HIM, we are still refining and changing some of the old Hope issues that have plagued the movement. From all the comments i have read, there are still pockets of Hope elements which are still there. I suppose its always hard to do wholesale changes and no doubt Hope's previous teaching will still have some impact especially those trained in Hope Thailand or have been very closely related to the Hope Church in Bangkok.

In summary issues that needs dealing with

1. BGR issues that have always been very poorly dealt with

2. Pride attitude always assuming we are the best

3. Poor people management skills by the leaders

4. Poor leadership training and selection of leadership based on favourtism rather than by lifestyle

5. Teachings and methods sometimes bodering on cultish behaviour
- Leaders telling members what to do
- People who leave church are often ostracised and cut off

6. Leadership often blaming people using the term "Bad spirit" instead of taking responsiblity.

Whatever 1 yr from now if this things still happen its anyone's guest. But i believe many people who are reading this or left will have stories which can relate to one of these points.

Hopefully HIM can take a bigger role in changing the old Hope Philosophy. Well, Happy Annivesary.


Anonymous said...

Yes, I think alot of this issues are still there. In fact, the Hope I used to be in the pastor will tell say tell you that its ok if you need to go to other church but yet when you are gone he back stabs you and tell people different stories. Its so unchristian like sometimes i wonder if people actually know how this pastor behaves.

He would not get the church people to cut you out and call u bad spirit. He behaves like a cult leader. In fact, he has told some of my friends that I would not be invited to their wedding just because I left church. And that if you want to be married in the church you need to obey him.

Maybe because he was from Hope Thailand that is why his philosophy is strange. In fact, i have caught him lying a few times. He tells me one thing and then tells people another thing. I found out because people are smart enough to ask me.

In fact many people left the church because they are not able to respect him. There are just so many stories.

Anyway,I hope the HIM leaders know about his "hope-style"

Shocked! said...

That is just horrible! What kind of a pastor is that??? Are you from a Hope church in Thailand? Or if not, let us know which region?

I think I read somewhere in the earlier posts about some Hope church pastor from Thailand too! I wonder if it's the same one? If it is, then something must be done! He's giving us in HIM a bad reputation!

Anonymous said...

What's there to be happy about? Why is there a need to mention "Happy Anniversary"?

Something must be wrong with you. You feel it's something worth 'celebrating'?

Yet, whatever happens, God is in control. He will let nothing bring harm to his Body, the Church.

Anonymous said...

The Pastor is in HIM unfortunately. Many people left because they notice that things were not very right. I suppose its a legacy of Hope Bangkok. Same teaching style and method of segregation.

Shocked! said...

Dear anonymous, would you mind telling us which region he is in? At least if any of the HIM leaders read this, they can follow up!

Why would that pastor stop you from going to the wedding? Even if you turn up, he can't chase you away right?
Also, to be married in the church you need to obey him? Obey him how?
Shouldn't it be about obeying God?

Anonymous said...


In the Hope Church where i used to be from. It is common knowledge that the pastor will call those who left the church as bad spirit. Even though in front of us, he would smile and pretend everything is ok, but behind us he backstabs everyone who left telling stories which are totally half-truth. The worst is many of those who left cannot defend themselves.

If not for some people who bother to call and find out. They would have bought the whole story.

It is also common knowledge, he does not welcome people to attend any wedding by the Hope members. So if you happen to have friend in the church, too bad. He expects those who want to get married to not invite them. Some are forced to obey him so that they can get married. This is the Hope Bangkok Style.

So if you wonder which region, there are not many in HIM who are trained and brought up in the Hope Bangkok ways of doing things..

This is only part of the incident. Some people left because, they told issues to the pastor in confidence but in the end all the leadership know about it.

He uses the excuse that leader must know to learn... But the question is we should never have used names and also try never to share down.

Its scary to think that such practice exist in church.


ex-hope said...

I believe in this... that God will be our vindicator if we have the right heart and are righteous. People can back-stab, gossip, spread half truths behind our backs, but God knows and He sees. We may lose our reputations infront of men, but we won't lose righteousness infront of God.

ex-member said...

Hi folks,

Read this-

Interestingly close to what has been shared here.

Anonymous said...

Dear ex-member, I think you might have left out the last part in your link...

This is the article you're referring to right? Couldn't be more true!

Anonymous said...

How weird... i copied and paste the link... it should have "1.html" at the end...

Anonymous said...

This was from the article!

"If more people boycotted such Christ-less hell holes that call themselves a church then perhaps legalistic religion would realize the pathetic product of its dogma and control."

If you read the whole article, you'll see just how true & how scary legalism can be!