I thought i better give some small summary as i was asked if I have facts to substantiate the issues
I will just summarize here so it can be a one look thing
Please note that some posts like : Future ahead are just questions we need to ask and there is no facts needed. Unless i am reporting a factual issue, i think i could not possibly offer facts on my own opinion on the incident. But where facts are involved, i have highlighted it.
Unless i missed out something. Please let me know
1. idolatory issue and teaching on worship idols
Factsheet
- the teaching is shown in the Video post from Foundation i posted up
- Statements were issued previously by North America churches in Hope regarding the issue ( documents with signatures available from post and also in biblediscuss.com)
- There is a video of the full teaching its in thai and big file so cannot put up ( but foundation have put up the relevant portion)
- 18 page statement ( PN have not been able to defend as of now - he has chosen to remain silent )
2. Finance and money used for Dr.J
- 18 page statement ( PN did not deny) this fact
- Elders meeting minutes which spoke about money transfer ( in post ) and in PDF
- Receipt of money transfer from HGI ( shown in video)
- Ps Somptop one of the account holders ( please note account Hope have a number of accounts and the correct procedure was all money to go to foundation and then the money will be disbursed out according) did not deny about the money being used - ( in the Foundation video - show the meeting when they had a members meet and tell session )
- Video shows also a wife of a former secretary " who ran away" because He knew the moeny issue was illegal and wrong. The wife went on the meet and tell and showed the letter her husband wrote and also begged him to come home ( the man ran away )
- Amount owed is still being finalised, but its going to the courts
3. Adultery issue of PN
- This is fact because it is reported by all Pastors from HGI so it cannot be false : my pastor have mentioned and also top leaders have not denied this happened check with your pastor
- Ps PK has issued a first statement about this
- PK has 2 other letters : one to state his intention and the other i heard ( this is have not seen) is to apologise for being too blunt.
4. Dr Dan or Dr J
Separation from wife
- mentioned in PK letter
- Dr.J's closet aide did not deny the issue
Mobilising of member to help in his election and changing their address so they can support kriengsak
- Ask the gound members in Hope Bangkok
- No one deny this fact, the bangkok regions have worked tirelessly during his campign
- This is an open secret
- Foundation I believe have prove ( ask them if you want to )
Denial of being founder of Hope
- My post have evidence of his old letters
- An article by Charisma magazine
- Apostle of Hope by Carolyn Boyd ( i think out of print )
- There is court transcript ( highlighted in my post ) showing he deny knowledge about being Hope founder
5. HGI going independent
- I am sure this fact i dont have to prove, as its already announced by individual churches
- Letter by Ps Simon ( If you want can ask your leader to show you )
- HGI in all i believe have issued 3 letters ( the whole reason well - go to biblediscuss.com)
6. Some thai churches joined Hope
- Yes there is
- Some thai church pastors have announced to their members
- If you want to confirm can ask people in Nexus Bangkok chruch or your leaders to confirm
- There are a number of churches that joined HGI mainly those who had stayed neutral
7. PN splitting the church
- In video
- Also widely known fact : they already have their own website
8. About PN side always asking people to just submit to authority
- You have to understand thai ( discussion between pro and non-pro PN supporters)
- Church members who listen to the sermons on Sunday
- Their key verse is the last post i put up Obey your leaders.
I think thats about it .... for those asking about fact and evidence. I cannot think of other things i mention that need evidence.
I hope this helps.
Friday, February 27, 2009
A good read
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Joined: January 3rd, 2009, 2:39 am
Posts: 2
Obeying your leaders: A short commentary on Hebrews 13:17Obey your leaders and submit to their authority. They keep watch over you as men who must give an account. Obey them so that their work will be a joy, not a burden, for that would be of no advantage to you.
~ Hebrews 13:17 (NIV)
Let me start this post by saying that I believe there is such a thing as biblical authority, and that it is healthy for believers to obey their spiritual overseers in the local church. What I want to focus on here is the nature of this obedience.
According to Vine's Expository Dictionary Of Old And New Testament Words, the Greek work translated here as "obey" is peitho. Elsewhere in the Bible, peitho is translated as: to yield, to believe, to be assured, to have confidence in, to trust, and to be persuaded by. The obedience here is the kind that comes from a trusting relationship between human beings.
In contrast, look at the Greek word hupakouo, which is also translated as obey in some parts of the Bible. According to Vine's, hupakouo is used for obedience in the following instances:
(a) to God by everyone and everything in Hebrews 5:9 and 11:8
(b) to Christ by natural elements in Matthew 8:27
(c) to disciples of Christ when they command a mulberry tree to uproot cast itself into the sea in Luke 17:6
(d) to the faith by new believers in Acts 6:7; and to the Gospel in Romans 10:16 and Christian doctrine in Romans 6:17 (as to a form or mold of teaching)
(e) to apostolic injunctions, such as in Philippians 2:12
(f) to Abraham by Sarah, as in 1 Peter 3:6
(g) to parents by children in Ephesians 6:1
(h) to masters by servants in Ephesians 6:5
(i) to sin by ourselves if unaided by God in Romans 6:12
(j) in general as slaves in Romans 6:16
See Vine's online here: http://vines.mike-obrien.net
Hupakouo is not about being persuaded or trusting in someone. No, it is about unquestioning, automatic obedience that comes from domineering authority. It's important to note that nowhere in the list does Vine's apply hupakouo to the obedience that should occur between church members and their spiritual overseers. The vital difference is a trusting relationship that produces a voluntary yielding and submission. Moreover, hupakouo is unquestioning, whereas peitho implies that the person obeying weighs the instruction in his or her mind, then deliberately decides to submit to a fellow human being. (Of course, our relationship with God is also trusting like a sheep with its good shepherd or between close friends, but our obedience occurs because He is our Lord and Master.)
What does this imply for obedience to spiritual overseers in the church? It means that we should consider the results of their faith. Hebrews 13:7 says, "Remember your leaders, who spoke the word of God to you. Consider the outcome of their way of life and imitate their faith." We should know their lives and their conduct. This should produce a natural trust. If you obey your boss at work, it's likely hupakouo (though you're lucky if it's peitho). Or if you get stopped by the police, you're not supposed to care about how the officer manages his or her affairs at home. Peitho is different. We know our leaders and trust them.
Moreover, we consider what they say. Like the Bereans in Acts 17, we look in the Bible to see what they say is true or not. Otherwise, if we are not to consider what they say, how can we "be persuaded by" them as peitho implies?
I'm interested to hear the thoughts of people who have considered this question. What is the nature of obedience in Hebrews 13:17?
~ Hebrews 13:17 (NIV)
Let me start this post by saying that I believe there is such a thing as biblical authority, and that it is healthy for believers to obey their spiritual overseers in the local church. What I want to focus on here is the nature of this obedience.
According to Vine's Expository Dictionary Of Old And New Testament Words, the Greek work translated here as "obey" is peitho. Elsewhere in the Bible, peitho is translated as: to yield, to believe, to be assured, to have confidence in, to trust, and to be persuaded by. The obedience here is the kind that comes from a trusting relationship between human beings.
In contrast, look at the Greek word hupakouo, which is also translated as obey in some parts of the Bible. According to Vine's, hupakouo is used for obedience in the following instances:
(a) to God by everyone and everything in Hebrews 5:9 and 11:8
(b) to Christ by natural elements in Matthew 8:27
(c) to disciples of Christ when they command a mulberry tree to uproot cast itself into the sea in Luke 17:6
(d) to the faith by new believers in Acts 6:7; and to the Gospel in Romans 10:16 and Christian doctrine in Romans 6:17 (as to a form or mold of teaching)
(e) to apostolic injunctions, such as in Philippians 2:12
(f) to Abraham by Sarah, as in 1 Peter 3:6
(g) to parents by children in Ephesians 6:1
(h) to masters by servants in Ephesians 6:5
(i) to sin by ourselves if unaided by God in Romans 6:12
(j) in general as slaves in Romans 6:16
See Vine's online here: http://vines.mike-obrien.net
Hupakouo is not about being persuaded or trusting in someone. No, it is about unquestioning, automatic obedience that comes from domineering authority. It's important to note that nowhere in the list does Vine's apply hupakouo to the obedience that should occur between church members and their spiritual overseers. The vital difference is a trusting relationship that produces a voluntary yielding and submission. Moreover, hupakouo is unquestioning, whereas peitho implies that the person obeying weighs the instruction in his or her mind, then deliberately decides to submit to a fellow human being. (Of course, our relationship with God is also trusting like a sheep with its good shepherd or between close friends, but our obedience occurs because He is our Lord and Master.)
What does this imply for obedience to spiritual overseers in the church? It means that we should consider the results of their faith. Hebrews 13:7 says, "Remember your leaders, who spoke the word of God to you. Consider the outcome of their way of life and imitate their faith." We should know their lives and their conduct. This should produce a natural trust. If you obey your boss at work, it's likely hupakouo (though you're lucky if it's peitho). Or if you get stopped by the police, you're not supposed to care about how the officer manages his or her affairs at home. Peitho is different. We know our leaders and trust them.
Moreover, we consider what they say. Like the Bereans in Acts 17, we look in the Bible to see what they say is true or not. Otherwise, if we are not to consider what they say, how can we "be persuaded by" them as peitho implies?
I'm interested to hear the thoughts of people who have considered this question. What is the nature of obedience in Hebrews 13:17?
Wednesday, February 25, 2009
Future ahead
I notice a lot of comments have been added to the blog, which is good because are asking questions. The one major aim of this blog is to give everyone a chance to read what is going on. Alot of the stuff are from the Hope Discussion forum which unfortunately is mostly in thai, the letters, the comments and general things are already available but only from the Thai mother church.
I suppose, one of the biggest reason is I wanted to give people evidence and information, and let people make their own decision. Alot of times things comes out in drips and draps and people often get wrong information along the way because it is just hearsay.
You will hear for example in the place where i am , HGI has choosen to leave Foundation and that PN and Dr.J have been stepped down, but not much details are provided, its always the less you know the better unless of course you are a leader. People only hear the conclusion but they do not know how the conclusion came about, so this what the blog is for.
Actually not many people will know the reason why HGI choose to stay independent and not join either PN nor foundation ?PN of course I understand, as for Foundation side what would be the reason ? the official reason was foundation did not follow standard procedure, but yet on foundation side they said they did. I do not think the leaders in Thailand would have followed foundation if what they did was wrong. Maybe the execution was not ideal but keeping issues of such magnitude would be tantamount to a grave sin. - Remember the catholic church who choose to keep Priest's indiscretion with boys a secret ? In the end the church was made to pay billions of dollars. Financial mismangment, idolatory and adultery were no small issues.
In fact, i know of people in HGI who would have preferred to stay with foundation. Would they actually start another Hope Church under foundation ? I dont know. Because now its a three-way split. PN Church, Foundation and HGI.
There are many other things to also consider for those who initially joined Hope because of the vision. Ok i must be the first to admit, sometimes it does feel weird when you go to Bangkok and you meet friends who used to be in the same Hope family now in different family.
My aim besides providing already available information from Thailand is to give people the information to make sound judgment.
In fact beyond the split there will be alot of tough questions to deal with
Eg. Is the 1 million 2015 still the same ? Will we be using the same V&P and mission statment ?
The name Hope of God is also a registered name so we might have to change name or Logo, we cannot be using the same as PN it will certainly cause confusion. It used to be a Theocracy where Bangkok was the ultimate elders, but without them how will we run ? Is it like Assembly of God style rotational or the same Hope Style ? What about the finance ?
One of the main reason for the split was because previously nobody ask question, if something did not seem right, we will sit down and hope the the problem will go away. This church belongs as much to the leaders as to the members who contribute our time, our effort and also our finances. Maybe that is why so many of us are so passionate and work up over this split. Trust me when you spend all your available time Mon-Sun .. going for shepherding, meeting, CG, outreach and give the best part of your life to build the church. People tend to be more interested to know they have not been led down the wrong path, that we are actually walking the talk, not just empty promises we cannot keep. Of course the opposite would have been true, if Hope is just your typical church where only the lay pastors serve and most members attend church and do nothing of course things might have been different. This blog might not happen at all.
In all whatever path we will all take in the future, I think the key thing is this - Every Church and movment have their own unique flavour, each have a role in overall body of Christ's church. Going independent is like taking the same ingredient of teachings, philosophy and structure but now with the ability to add a new twist along the way, i do believe every member who decide to stay with HGI can contribute in this rebuilding project. Its not easy but it can be done
So i shall leave you with the words of Dr.J - "One man can change the world"
PS - I am still working on the video and should be ready end of this week. The video by foundation is very detailed and covers all the grounds, i otherwise would have find hard to cover.
I suppose, one of the biggest reason is I wanted to give people evidence and information, and let people make their own decision. Alot of times things comes out in drips and draps and people often get wrong information along the way because it is just hearsay.
You will hear for example in the place where i am , HGI has choosen to leave Foundation and that PN and Dr.J have been stepped down, but not much details are provided, its always the less you know the better unless of course you are a leader. People only hear the conclusion but they do not know how the conclusion came about, so this what the blog is for.
Actually not many people will know the reason why HGI choose to stay independent and not join either PN nor foundation ?PN of course I understand, as for Foundation side what would be the reason ? the official reason was foundation did not follow standard procedure, but yet on foundation side they said they did. I do not think the leaders in Thailand would have followed foundation if what they did was wrong. Maybe the execution was not ideal but keeping issues of such magnitude would be tantamount to a grave sin. - Remember the catholic church who choose to keep Priest's indiscretion with boys a secret ? In the end the church was made to pay billions of dollars. Financial mismangment, idolatory and adultery were no small issues.
In fact, i know of people in HGI who would have preferred to stay with foundation. Would they actually start another Hope Church under foundation ? I dont know. Because now its a three-way split. PN Church, Foundation and HGI.
There are many other things to also consider for those who initially joined Hope because of the vision. Ok i must be the first to admit, sometimes it does feel weird when you go to Bangkok and you meet friends who used to be in the same Hope family now in different family.
My aim besides providing already available information from Thailand is to give people the information to make sound judgment.
In fact beyond the split there will be alot of tough questions to deal with
Eg. Is the 1 million 2015 still the same ? Will we be using the same V&P and mission statment ?
The name Hope of God is also a registered name so we might have to change name or Logo, we cannot be using the same as PN it will certainly cause confusion. It used to be a Theocracy where Bangkok was the ultimate elders, but without them how will we run ? Is it like Assembly of God style rotational or the same Hope Style ? What about the finance ?
One of the main reason for the split was because previously nobody ask question, if something did not seem right, we will sit down and hope the the problem will go away. This church belongs as much to the leaders as to the members who contribute our time, our effort and also our finances. Maybe that is why so many of us are so passionate and work up over this split. Trust me when you spend all your available time Mon-Sun .. going for shepherding, meeting, CG, outreach and give the best part of your life to build the church. People tend to be more interested to know they have not been led down the wrong path, that we are actually walking the talk, not just empty promises we cannot keep. Of course the opposite would have been true, if Hope is just your typical church where only the lay pastors serve and most members attend church and do nothing of course things might have been different. This blog might not happen at all.
In all whatever path we will all take in the future, I think the key thing is this - Every Church and movment have their own unique flavour, each have a role in overall body of Christ's church. Going independent is like taking the same ingredient of teachings, philosophy and structure but now with the ability to add a new twist along the way, i do believe every member who decide to stay with HGI can contribute in this rebuilding project. Its not easy but it can be done
So i shall leave you with the words of Dr.J - "One man can change the world"
PS - I am still working on the video and should be ready end of this week. The video by foundation is very detailed and covers all the grounds, i otherwise would have find hard to cover.
Sunday, February 22, 2009
HGI Letter ?
Well, I suppose since many people are on the blog, I believe the new statement have been send out by HGI
I am not sure if anyone has the statement in writing though, personally i do think that the statment should be made official and handed to people so that we can for once cut off ties with PN and Dr.J rather than leave doubt about our link
Someone mentioned that HGI will have a website up but I am still waiting.
In summary, the letter is
1. HGI have handed the letter of termination to PN and Dr.J both as president and as advisors
2. We will treat Dr.J as a friend only
3. We will be on our own and not join Foundation
4. we will still keep the friendship but that is about it
I think that is the summary if i am wrong please let me know as i dont have the full letter, its not on Bible discuss website. And the announcements are made by word or mouth though
Personally, i hope as leaders of God's church we will be more accountable and to realise that members are as much to the church as the leaders and we need to make everything as transparent as possible so that issues like these will not happen ever again.
Conclusion
I think the main thing is that leaders should stop treating members like children and make sure that members of the church will always be kept informed, Hope failed in the first case because information was not forthcoming and people failed to query, when something did not seem right, no one dare question Dr.J when he suddenly disappeared.
I hope this lesson will make members understand that we are also accountable to God for what happens in our church. Leaders and members alike must be good steward and ensure that we ask if we are not sure and not just take the " leaders know best answer", because if we strip down to the basic, leaders are still human and they are still like all of us, leaders will make mistakes like all of us, leaders are still prone to emotions like of us.
Remember the story of "Animal Farm" - it all started wih a good idea every animal had one common dream, a common desire. But soon corruptions took hold and the dreams soon shattered
So for us all in HGI now, we must always take the lessons from our past and make it a mistake we will not make again, for if we are to win the world first we need to win again the trust of our people that our leaders are honest, God fearing and people of integrity.
I am not sure if anyone has the statement in writing though, personally i do think that the statment should be made official and handed to people so that we can for once cut off ties with PN and Dr.J rather than leave doubt about our link
Someone mentioned that HGI will have a website up but I am still waiting.
In summary, the letter is
1. HGI have handed the letter of termination to PN and Dr.J both as president and as advisors
2. We will treat Dr.J as a friend only
3. We will be on our own and not join Foundation
4. we will still keep the friendship but that is about it
I think that is the summary if i am wrong please let me know as i dont have the full letter, its not on Bible discuss website. And the announcements are made by word or mouth though
Personally, i hope as leaders of God's church we will be more accountable and to realise that members are as much to the church as the leaders and we need to make everything as transparent as possible so that issues like these will not happen ever again.
Conclusion
I think the main thing is that leaders should stop treating members like children and make sure that members of the church will always be kept informed, Hope failed in the first case because information was not forthcoming and people failed to query, when something did not seem right, no one dare question Dr.J when he suddenly disappeared.
I hope this lesson will make members understand that we are also accountable to God for what happens in our church. Leaders and members alike must be good steward and ensure that we ask if we are not sure and not just take the " leaders know best answer", because if we strip down to the basic, leaders are still human and they are still like all of us, leaders will make mistakes like all of us, leaders are still prone to emotions like of us.
Remember the story of "Animal Farm" - it all started wih a good idea every animal had one common dream, a common desire. But soon corruptions took hold and the dreams soon shattered
So for us all in HGI now, we must always take the lessons from our past and make it a mistake we will not make again, for if we are to win the world first we need to win again the trust of our people that our leaders are honest, God fearing and people of integrity.
Thursday, February 19, 2009
Post from Bangkok Knight
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Joined: November 26th, 2008, 6:35 pm
Posts: 18
Ps. Rubina's Actions!!This was some thoughts that I expressed couple of weeks ago when the problems started in church. Thought I would share to the international group. Hope it's not too late!!
There is something I should point out believing that it's not fair for Ps. Rubina if we make judgements of her actions for sending out the 18 page email which is the truth according to her. WHY?
1. Considering Ps. Rubina's family background, education, maturity and her loyalty and sacrifice to the church I believe she tried to talk and other ways possible (as advised in the Bible) but that did not yield any results so came the email which we think was not appropriate. But how do we know if it's appropriate or not since we are not in her position and the legal responsibilities she has as the President of the Foundation.
2. Without the email this news could have circulated to every level of the church as a rumor and could have been labeled as false and people spreading the rumor could have been labeled as traitors to the church. This would have caused even more damage to the church or the people involved and the truth would not have been known.
3. Ps. Rubina sent the email and she took responsibility for it she did not hide and deny it.
4. If church people are to stumble it's not because of The Email
- in the past one year people have left the church not because of the email
- people have resigned from full time staff not because of the email
- and many more things that happened not because of the email
So why are people putting the blame on the Email??
If it is true before anyone was to support or spend offering money for sensitive issues they should have know that their actions will cause people to stumble if done in an inappropriate way. That email is the result of that action/decision. By the way so far I have not heard anyone leaving the church or forsaking God because of the email. But instead it has created awareness and concern for the church of God. What I see is people coming out to protect His church.
5. Lets not loose or shift focus. All this happened not because of the email but because people like you and me feel something is not right here and we need someone in authority to please come out and clarify so that people don't STUMBLE and the church can move in the same direction again. No one hates or wants to destroy anyone all that needs to be done is someone has to take responsibility and clarify things.
6. God has His ways to do things if He wants He can use (humans, emails, nature etc etc....) to make things known and right. So lets not limit Him and have an open heart as to the WAYS AND WHAT He uses in this case.
7. Even if outsiders attack us on this everything that will happen will happen only if God allows. Christians were persecuted and killed during the Romans but it helped to spread Christianity. So lets not panic or speculate about what the email will do to our image and let God be God.
8. If (I’m not saying it is) the email is true what we should be focusing on is how are we going to balance the accounts because end year is approaching and this is clear black and white when it comes to the law of the country. When outsiders look at us they don’t care who has spiritual authority or not all they care is how they can find fault in our system and create problems. So lets not point fingers and use the Bible for the sake of argument because the Bible is a double-edge sword and both sides can use it to support their cause.
If (I’m not saying it is) money is really missing then something must be done SOON if we as members have to help offer back to balance the books "so be it" I am happy with that and I believe everyone would be too because we want to protect the church and the name of God which should be our No. 1 priority. But at the end of the day someone still has to take responsibility and clarify things.
I hope I'm not being biased here and I have not mentioned any names except for Ps. Rubina because I don't think it right to blame her for doing the right thing even though in many people eyes her method was inappropriate or she did not have the authority but we don't know that until we see how God will move in this situation. We all love our church, pastors and everyone that we call brothers and sisters and we all sincerely believe that no one in Hope has any ill intentions towards the church.
No matter what the end result of this situation is weather it was a misunderstanding or the truth or what ever might happen we should look at this as a lesson for us to prepare for the end times coz that’s when it gets worst spiritually, mentally and physically so lets sit tight and pray and wait and see how God moves in this situation.
There is something I should point out believing that it's not fair for Ps. Rubina if we make judgements of her actions for sending out the 18 page email which is the truth according to her. WHY?
1. Considering Ps. Rubina's family background, education, maturity and her loyalty and sacrifice to the church I believe she tried to talk and other ways possible (as advised in the Bible) but that did not yield any results so came the email which we think was not appropriate. But how do we know if it's appropriate or not since we are not in her position and the legal responsibilities she has as the President of the Foundation.
2. Without the email this news could have circulated to every level of the church as a rumor and could have been labeled as false and people spreading the rumor could have been labeled as traitors to the church. This would have caused even more damage to the church or the people involved and the truth would not have been known.
3. Ps. Rubina sent the email and she took responsibility for it she did not hide and deny it.
4. If church people are to stumble it's not because of The Email
- in the past one year people have left the church not because of the email
- people have resigned from full time staff not because of the email
- and many more things that happened not because of the email
So why are people putting the blame on the Email??
If it is true before anyone was to support or spend offering money for sensitive issues they should have know that their actions will cause people to stumble if done in an inappropriate way. That email is the result of that action/decision. By the way so far I have not heard anyone leaving the church or forsaking God because of the email. But instead it has created awareness and concern for the church of God. What I see is people coming out to protect His church.
5. Lets not loose or shift focus. All this happened not because of the email but because people like you and me feel something is not right here and we need someone in authority to please come out and clarify so that people don't STUMBLE and the church can move in the same direction again. No one hates or wants to destroy anyone all that needs to be done is someone has to take responsibility and clarify things.
6. God has His ways to do things if He wants He can use (humans, emails, nature etc etc....) to make things known and right. So lets not limit Him and have an open heart as to the WAYS AND WHAT He uses in this case.
7. Even if outsiders attack us on this everything that will happen will happen only if God allows. Christians were persecuted and killed during the Romans but it helped to spread Christianity. So lets not panic or speculate about what the email will do to our image and let God be God.
8. If (I’m not saying it is) the email is true what we should be focusing on is how are we going to balance the accounts because end year is approaching and this is clear black and white when it comes to the law of the country. When outsiders look at us they don’t care who has spiritual authority or not all they care is how they can find fault in our system and create problems. So lets not point fingers and use the Bible for the sake of argument because the Bible is a double-edge sword and both sides can use it to support their cause.
If (I’m not saying it is) money is really missing then something must be done SOON if we as members have to help offer back to balance the books "so be it" I am happy with that and I believe everyone would be too because we want to protect the church and the name of God which should be our No. 1 priority. But at the end of the day someone still has to take responsibility and clarify things.
I hope I'm not being biased here and I have not mentioned any names except for Ps. Rubina because I don't think it right to blame her for doing the right thing even though in many people eyes her method was inappropriate or she did not have the authority but we don't know that until we see how God will move in this situation. We all love our church, pastors and everyone that we call brothers and sisters and we all sincerely believe that no one in Hope has any ill intentions towards the church.
No matter what the end result of this situation is weather it was a misunderstanding or the truth or what ever might happen we should look at this as a lesson for us to prepare for the end times coz that’s when it gets worst spiritually, mentally and physically so lets sit tight and pray and wait and see how God moves in this situation.
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